Algenon Cash shares his take on the state of the restaurant industry. He touches on many of the issues that restaurants face now and in the future. Learn what efforts he is taking to ensure that restaurants and their employees are inspired and motivated.
Algenon Cash shares his take on the state of the restaurant industry. He touches on many of the issues that restaurants face now and in the future. Learn what efforts he is taking to ensure that restaurants and their employees are inspired and motivated.
Announcer 0:01
Welcome to restaurant radio, a place for lively and candid conversations about working in the restaurant industry. Tune in as insiders talk about the good, the bad, and the sometimes ugly of today's kitchen culture. Now, here's your host, Nan Wilkinson.
Nan Wilkinson 0:18
Hi, everybody. Welcome back to restaurant radio today, my special guest is Algernon cash. Algenon is a North Carolina native, and a lover of the restaurant industry. So we're excited to have him on today. Thanks for being here.
Algenon Cash 0:38
Thank you for inviting me.
Unknown Speaker 0:39
Absolutely. So Algernon, I know you wear many different hats. I know you've been very much involved in the restaurant industry. So I just want to ask you a few questions. I know you sort of work with the triad area, and I'm more in the Raleigh type area. But um, tell me what you're seeing out there post pandemic? I mean, how are things looking? All in all?
Algenon Cash 1:01
Yeah, you know, I'm sure what we're seeing here in the triad area is no different than most likely what you're seeing over in the Triangle region, as well as what they're seeing all across North, all across North Carolina, and all across the country, I think restaurants continue to be challenged and have a lot of struggles out in front of them, you know, coming out of this pandemic, pandemic. Excuse me, um, of course, during the pandemic, I mean, obviously, you had a lot of restaurants that just completely shut down and have decided not to reopen. Since then I think we've seen a big rebound in customer traffic. So it does feel like to me, customers, and guests are a lot more comfortable with getting back inside of restaurants. So we've seen a huge rebound there. But we haven't seen such a rebound on the worker side. And so restaurants continue to be very short staffed and unable, at times to deal with all the demand they see walking through their door. And then in addition to just the rising cost of food and disposables, and inflationary pressure everywhere, is really creating a perfect storm for restaurants to continue to just be challenged.
Nan Wilkinson 2:08
That is absolutely for sure. And I'm going to back up just a second. So correct me if I'm wrong, but you've been at you've actually worked in the restaurant industry, I know you've owned a restaurant as well, or, and in ghost kitchen, but you've actually worked in restaurants Correct.
Algenon Cash 2:23
I have I've worked in restaurants since I was 15 years old when I was making biscuits at McDonald's. You know, I've been a busboy, a dishwasher, a bartender, a server, they're definitely done a little bit everything. I'm still partners in several restaurants today. I don't have a restaurant that I operate any longer. I did have a restaurant that I launched in 2017 Zesto burgers and ice cream, where I actually also played an operation operator role. But yes, still still very much immersed in the restaurant business also provide a lot of consulting to restaurant owners and operators. And then obviously my role with eat drink triad places me right at the the eye of the hurricane when it comes to restaurants in our market. There you
Nan Wilkinson 3:05
go. Well, tell me a little bit about eat drink triad, how, how that got started and what your goal is with that?
Algenon Cash 3:11
Yeah, you know, in response to the the COVID pandemic, we or myself and a few others, we created the triad food and beverage Coalition, which which is really more of an advocacy type program designed to provide education to our elected officials and community leaders and state leaders. And just help them to understand the impact that COVID was having on restaurants, and essentially just provide some advocacy on Potat on behalf of owners and operators and restaurant employees. As we continue to get deeper and deeper into the pandemic and then subsequently even was able to get the pandemic behind us. About a year ago, we created an outreach program by the name of eat drink triad. And so this was my attempt to pivot away from advocacy and more towards outreach and marketing. And so really, the goal of eat drink triad is to try to tell stories, we develop a lot of original content, but we tell stories about the food and beverage community, we try to help people to understand better, who started these restaurants, why they have such the passion they do, what their challenges and opportunities might be. We host events. We also do restaurant week, twice a year, which again, is designed to bring visibility to the food and beverage community and encourage people to actually go in restaurants and and try them out. And then a sense, we in a sense, we still do a lot of advocacy and providing advice to the industry as well.
Nan Wilkinson 4:34
I love it. And of course your pictures are amazing. Whoever's taking them are doing a phenomenal job and they make you want to go out and try every place that you put out there. And I think it's fantastic. And, you know, certainly the restaurant industry, really any industry can use an advocate at any point, but what you're doing is just wonderful. And like you said, I think so many times, you know people who own restaurants, especially, you know, the independent restaurants, you know, they're they're working hard in their business, and they don't have a chance to talk with people and I can share their story. And let people know just really how much is involved in owning and running a business, especially these days, like you said, with all of the, the challenges across the board, not to mention the labor piece, which I'm actually hopefully trying to address with what with what I'm doing. But um, it's a, it's a lot, it's a lot of work. And I think that's a wonderful thing that you're doing. And I have to tell you that I've watched a bunch of your videos and back even a few years back, and I just absolutely love your passion, and it never wanes. And I'm just really, I'm really impressed that you just keep going out. It's so hard and are so passionate about these different things. So thank you for all you do for our industry. First of all, I It's greatly appreciated. So well, both Thank
Algenon Cash 5:47
you for listening and supporting. You know, for several years, I did radio with intercom and 97.1 as well as one or 2.1. And, you know, I used to always famously say to people, you know, I have a lot to say, but it doesn't matter if no one's listening. And so I always, you know, you're very thankful when someone shares that they've taken the time to listen and watch what we're producing.
Nan Wilkinson 6:09
Well, I agree. And I think, you know, as one of your videos said, we need to kind of come together as a group and try to promote one another so that we can make it better for everyone. So I greatly appreciate that. So let me go back to the employment piece for just a second. So I've been in the business for 40 years, and I've been, you know, the employee piece has always been iffy. It's been difficult. Of course, now, it's worse than it's ever been to the point where it's crippling for businesses, not only crippling, but businesses have shut down either for days, or shifts, or altogether, or have not started new locations, because again, there's just not enough staff and those people that are in it, are working their butts off, they're stressed. There's just a lot going on. And so, you know, I know that with the wage piece of what we're doing is always been, again, sketchy iffy. And so that's I think being addressed. But honestly, algin I think, for me that that's just the tip of the iceberg for things, I think that the elephant in the room. And the bigger problem that we have really is the culture that has evolved or has maintained throughout the time in this industry. And again, I've been doing this for 40 years, and I do believe there needs to be a shift in that. And so that's where I think we need to start looking at how the industry and their employees can be, for lack of a better word more professional, like the people at every level of that job, whether you're starting as a dishwasher, and I know many people that have started as dishwashers and become, you know, restaurant owners or managers or whatever, but that every position can go somewhere else. Like there's there's more to it and how to do that and how to do it professionally. And that. Anyway, that's my passion is to try to make some of those changes. So I know that you had again, when you had I think it was the ghost kitchen. Is that correct? You had some struggles with? Obviously, the labor piece of it. What what is your take on what all the different issues are with why we don't have labor? Let's I mean, let's keep the pandemic and kind of government funding for a second, let's look at, you know, sort of like the core issues that I think we have and tell me your take.
Algenon Cash 8:23
Yeah, I mean, I, I mean, it's so multifaceted. It's hard to squeeze into just a few minutes. It's hard to talk about without necessarily including the pandemic, and obviously, some of the government stimulus money that was provided, you know, to individuals and families, because I do think the pandemic as well, as you know, the government sending out a lot of checks was the impetus to a lot of people actually exiting the industry. I mean, people may have wanted to exit the industry before, but I think COVID certainly gave people a reason to go ahead and go through with it. And then obviously, some of the government stimulus money also provided a pathway for a lot of people to leave the industry. And I'm not saying that's necessarily a bad thing, because for some people who wanted to go get better educated or wanted to pick up new skills, and try to acquire a job in a different industry that that's great for them and we should all want everybody to to move up in the world side. I think it's hard to talk about the issue without including those those two big components. I think the the other piece that's happening right now is just the the paradigm and the culture around work in itself has shifted quite a bit especially amongst the young generation. So when they look to enter the labor market, they may not no longer be looking to become a dishwasher and move up in a very traditional and conventional kind of way. They have watched you know many people and many of their peers really get rich overnight. Yeah, whether it whether it be create some startup company or some new technology base company that's disruptive to a certain industry. So they, they are very familiar with seeing people take a different pathway. And so rightfully, they, they also are desiring to take a different pathway. So just the culture around work itself has been upset quite a bit. But then you know, the culture around consumers and how consumers consume goods and services and how they engage with restaurants and retailers, and so many others, that's changed quite a bit as well. And people have different expectations and different demands. You know, for the longest, I would hear people talk so negatively about Walmart and Target and all the big box retailers. And they would say, man, if these big box stores would just go away, we could protect the local mom and pop stores. Well, the reality is, the reason they never went away is because people were actually shopping there. People actually wanted those good deals, people want to go in Walmart and get a really good deal, people want to go in Sam's Club, and be able to get this really great deal. People want to order on Amazon because it's more convenient. So there's just been a real fundamental shift in consumer behavior pattern. And that along with shifts in how people view work, you know, combined with this huge milestone pandemic event that we went through, and an unprecedented amount of government spending, you start to take all these variables, and it starts to make sense, while we're seeing the quantum shift that we're seeing in the restaurant labor market right now.
Nan Wilkinson 11:27
I totally agree with everything that you're saying I do. Buy, I do also believe that our industry has, for a while been losing more than it's been gaining. And again, this is this just came out not too long ago. But and this is since then, but we, as an industry lost, people quit their jobs at double the rate that they did any other industry. I think that was in the last one came out in January was the quit rate from the Bureau of Labor and Statistics. And to me, that just really speaks a lot about our industry in general. And I'm, I'm on some groups on Facebook, and you know, listening to what people say, and it just feels like even like even the the money piece of thing, if that problem was solved, or people paid a living wage or whatever, tomorrow, we would still not have enough people. And I still firmly believe that they look at this industry. Not I mean, I don't think a lot of people look at this industry in a great light, as far as you know, how they're treated. I mean, do you do you have any take on that?
Algenon Cash 12:34
Yeah, I mean, I don't I think that perspective that people have of the restaurant industry is the same perspective people have of the construction industry. I mean, the construction industry is very, very difficult. The same reason they're having trouble being able to acquire labor right now, it's because people don't want to be out in the hot science on land concrete. It's a it's a very difficult industry, you've got very difficult superintendents, you've got contractors that have timelines they have to keep so they can be very, you know, hard on their employees. It's the same thing within the restaurant industry. It's a very difficult industry, some people don't want to stand over a 400 degree grill and cook hamburgers all night on a Friday night, or be at work until one or two o'clock in the morning and you close at 11 because you're trying to clean the grill in the kitchen and scrub dishes and do those things the the nature around how people see work has shifted so much and so fundamentally, that I think some of these entry level type industries, whether it be food and beverage, or construction, and so many others that they they're, they're suffering because of it. Now we can talk about the wage piece. And the wage piece sort of goes back to the point that I just made around consumer behavior habits. Now if we lined up 10 consumers, and we said, Hey, should we all pay restaurant owners more? I think you'd be hard pressed to get one consumer to say no, like all 10 would say yes. But then if we asked the same 10 consumers that favorite steak that you'd like to have on Friday night, would it be okay? If we charge $8 More, you'd be hard pressed to get three out of 10. I agree with you. So you know, people are sort of talking out of both sides of their mouth. On one side, they're saying we should be paying a living wage. But on the other side, they don't necessarily want to pay more for the food. And unfortunately, those numbers just don't add up.
Nan Wilkinson 14:23
No, you're absolutely right. And actually, I have a I'm doing a podcast with Dr. Amy glass. Meyer. She actually is the one who created the living wage calculator. She's at MIT. And we're going to talk a little bit about how people can kind of, she says back into that equation to try to figure out how to at least start to pay better if you can't, you can't hit the living wage mark, which is a very high number even out in Washington state where they've got one of the highest, you know, wages in the country. They still aren't hitting what is considered a living wage for them. But anyway, so yeah, I agree with that. But I I think that I think that that really is still something that needs to be addressed. And, again, how to work into that maybe by pay more, you don't necessarily, you don't necessarily make people a better employee by paying them better. But perhaps by paying better, you can get better employees, maybe you can look at adjusting your menu so that the people that you have aren't as stressed out and can do more, if you will not make them necessarily work harder, but they're able to produce more, because there's less, you know, prep or whatever the case may be. I mean, we can talk all day about that. But I think that there has to be a way to figure out what that number is, and how the restaurant tour can can charge that price. And you know, it's interesting, I was talking to somebody else about prices, like you go to the grocery store, they, they don't hold their prices, they they get paid charge something more, they pass that on. And so the restaurant tour, though, I think has this fear, and I've been there and done that this fear of oh my gosh, I'm going to raise my prices, and no one's going to come in now. Yeah, I think for sure you can price yourself out of the market. But I think if you start to make some price adjustments, and sort of plan a little bit, even for the future price increases, that people would be people won't feel it as much. I mean, you know, find a way to add some items that maybe don't, aren't as expensive. And anyway, we don't need to go down that. But I think there's things that they can do and need to raise their prices if need be. I've never heard anyone, maybe you have but I've never heard anyone say I went out of business because my prices were too high. Now, maybe that
Algenon Cash 16:36
I have, yeah, I've heard I've had several people go out of business for that.
Nan Wilkinson 16:41
Interesting. Okay. Well, I think that you have to know what your market can kind of bear. But I think you also need to charge a fair price. I've also seen way too many restaurant people look and go, I can't charge more, because so and so down the street is charging whatever. And my first question to them is is are they making money? I mean, you can't assume just because someone's charging something on their menu, and they're in business, they're open that they're making money. And so it's, it's a difficult equation, but it's definitely, I think it's definitely something we need to look at and talk about, because, you know, people need to be able to pay, we paid them an amount that they can live on. And I don't want to say living wage, but if you you know, if you pay somebody a minimum wage and expect them to stay with you, and not have to get three other jobs and just be you know, work nights, weekends and holidays. I think that's a little delusional, in my opinion.
Algenon Cash 17:39
Yeah, I don't I don't think anyone necessarily expects these people to stay with them forever. You know, when when I was being paid $5.75 cent to be the biscuit maker at McDonald's. I don't think Rich Halverson, who was the owner at the time, I don't, I don't think he thought I was gonna be working there for the rest of my life, he probably thought I was going to be using that position to move up and go do bigger and better things, which is what I did. And I think that should be the expectation still still today. The reality is, restaurant owners will not be able to pay more, and do the kind of things you're describing, if they cannot actually earn more. There are so many things that go on inside of a restaurant operation, that the average person walking down the street is completely unaware of that it's almost it's almost laughable the amount of calls that a restaurant owner absorbs on any given day, you made the reference of the fact that within the grocery store business, they constantly change their prices. So every time they receive new inventory, they they can they really they label their prices all the time. So you know, the price of eggs may not be the same the next week, or the week after that price of beef may not be the same, even necessarily from day to day, it doesn't work like that in the restaurant business, right? When people suggest it, I laugh a little bit. We can't print menus every single day, we can't even print menus every month. So you know, once you print your menu, your price is set, that doesn't necessarily mean that the price of the raw good itself is the raw material price is still going to change the price of beef is still going to fluctuate the price of bags just for me to bag my to go items. They fluctuate every single week, you know, so you're you're pricing your menu items in a way that you hope and pray that you can absorb some of those shocks. Sometimes you're not able to absorb all those shocks. And so you have a much lower profit margin on an item than you should so it is much more difficult than people standing on the outside. You know, trying to Monday morning quarterback this thing, it's much more difficult than they think it is. And for those people who think it's so easy, I am strongly encouraged in the suit up and get into the business.
Nan Wilkinson 19:45
Yeah, you know, I remember so I had a little bakery and deli out in Washington state for a while and you know, baked goods. Yeah, they're fun ever. You know, people love to eat cookies and croissants and stuff. And I remember one customer she's like, Oh, this just looks like so much fun. And she said I'd love to come work with y'all for And so she did, because I just like you're saying, I knew that this would happen. And again, I loved what I did. But at the end of the day, when you go to work it is its work this is you're not just going in to make cookies for the local, you know, school or whatever, or the kids on the block here. So, you know, she's like, wow, okay, I didn't know you guys made 400 of these cookies and 400 of these, and you make these, you lug these big bags around, and you got to watch and keep things from burning. And she's like, you know, it's a lot of work. And it is stressful. And but again, if you love it, you love it. But I think somebody's looking in, as you're mentioning from the outside, just kind of sees food show up. I mean, heck, cook at home. I mean, by the time you go shopping for it, prep it up, cook it clean from it. I mean, it's it's a lot and it's time consuming. And
Algenon Cash 20:46
then And then even you mentioned a moment ago, you talked a little bit about, you know, could you lower or could you you know, just menu items, so you can make your your prep a lot easier. Again, that goes back to consumer behavior, consumers now more than ever, because they sit at home and watch Food Network. And all these food shows, consumers more than that, now more than ever expect when they come in a restaurant, that thing should be fresh, it should be made from scratch. They don't want frozen products, they don't want pre made products. And so all the things that you're even suggesting are things that a restaurant that wants to remain viable, and wants to stay open, they better not go down that road, they better not start messing around with the quality of food. Because if they do that, that same customer is not going to come in. So you know, yes, I think when you look at fast food, when you look at fast casual, part of the way that they're going to solve the issues that you and I've been talking about today is probably through automation, I talked to a lot of restaurant owners that are moving more in the direction of automation. The unfortunate thing about that is that's actually not going to necessarily raise wages, that's actually just going to cause some people not to have a job. I think a lot of the entry level employment that exists in fast food and fast casual, over the next 10 years is going to start to go away. And then I think fine dining is where you're still going to have people actually making things from scratch and doing the kinds of things in the kitchen that can be very labor and capital intensive.
Nan Wilkinson 22:10
No, I I agree with that. And I guess when I was talking about sort of the things that are further processes, like you can buy, you can buy fresh diced onions, now shredded cabbage already, you can buy chicken, that's fresh chicken, it's already sliced
Algenon Cash 22:21
quality's not there, it's not the same. I trust me, when I ran Zesto, we bought tomatoes that were already sliced, we bought onions that were already diced, we brought peppers that were already ready to go. You can do those things, those those types of products do exist. But if you go talk to any chef in America and say, Would you rather have an onion that's pre dice and sliced? Or would you rather dice and slice it fresh yourself? They're always going to choose the second option?
Nan Wilkinson 22:46
Well, sure, yes, but it Yeah, I agree. We will. We won't debate that point. But you know, the other thing, you know, you're saying about the automation. And yeah, and actually, I have a call with a guy that has a robotics, he had the National Restaurant Association show a couple years ago, when they had the last one, he had this robot there that actually served food. And of course, there's all sorts of stuff you can do, that don't even require a robot, which is, you know, have people order, you know, at the table themselves with an iPad, like you said, not at a fine dining place, but there are things. So he and I are going to get on a call about what that future sort of looks like. And truthfully, you know, my first thought was, is oh my gosh, like you said, it's going to take away jobs. But what if it doesn't do this? I mean, obviously, we have such a huge hole in in that gap of needing people, what if it just fills the hole, and we can take those entry level jobs and put people a little further up, pay them a little more, train them a little better. And now we've got somebody that might be more interested in staying or moving up in the industry. I just feel like there's a there is a place that they can be that doesn't necessarily displace anyone else.
Algenon Cash 23:53
I, you know, that's an economic question, and always a bit difficult to answer. I mean, because the economy depends on so many variables going in one direction or the other side. I have no idea. I mean, you know, we would like to believe what you just said, would happen, certainly in a perfect world. But what I can tell you is getting ready to happen. My daughter who was at 15 years old, she her first job was at my restaurant at Zesto. She was a cashier. There, there will be a time when you're 15 or 16 years old, that opportunity won't exist, because restaurants are moving towards automation at the counter. You know, I sat in a restaurant about two weeks ago, and the only time I had any or any interaction with a human was when they dropped my food off. And that was basically they don't their service at the restaurant I was sitting at and I won't say their name. Their service was so automated that even when you need a refills, you pushed a button and somebody brought it to you. So which was what we're moving towards a moving into is that for people like my daughter who you know, at 15 The way she established a work ethic was by being able to go work at a restaurant and work the cashier and work the front and take orders those kinds of opportunities are going away. Now, to your point, hopefully, there's a new bigger and better opportunity for 15 year old 15 year olds that want to go work and and start off. But you know, if there isn't that the challenge with that, and I'm someone, you know, through our black Empowerment Network, we care a lot about what goes on in low income and predominantly African American neighborhoods, you have a lot of African American kids that count on these jobs. This is this is sort of the way they get out of the hood, quote, unquote, this is the way I got out of it. You know, so So I just, I just think that when we when we look at these things, and we say, Well, hey, why don't we just do this? Or, well, this is a quick fix, we'll just do this. I just don't know if we always think about the indirect impact of some of our choices.
Nan Wilkinson 25:45
Yeah, no, I mean, and I, I totally hear what you're saying. And I don't know what that like you said economic balances, as far as you know, the, the robotics and AI and all that sort of stuff versus what what the needs are and how it would fill in. And but yeah, I mean, that's definitely a valid point. Now, John, this has been a pleasure. Let me just ask you, just what would be some parting words of wisdom or advice for either the employers or the employees in this industry?
Algenon Cash 26:14
Yeah, I mean, on both sides, I think on the employee side, you know, everything I've said today in our conversation, and you can tell how passionate I am about the food and beverage community, because I have been attached to it since I was, you know, 15 years old. You know, on the employee side, I think people should continue to do exactly what's best for them. You know, I had a cook that worked for me. And she, when we close us, though, she decided to get out of the industry, it was at a time where again, a lot of government stimulus was happening. She was very smart, she used her money, wisely, she went back to community college, she picked up a new scale, she's now working for a company, she works from home, for a company based out in the Midwest, she's making more money, she's spending more time with her kids. And I'm thrilled for her and I will every employee that hears this discussion, you should constantly make the best decision for you and your family. And if that means getting out of the industry and going to take a job at Amazon, because they're paying $20 An hour and giving you benefits and dental benefits and all those things, you shouldn't hesitate one bit to go make that transition, I would just say to employees that you know, try to recognize the the struggle that our industry is going through. Also maybe try to recall or remember how good our industry was to you at a time when you most need it. And so as you transition out of the industry, do it professionally and respectfully. Make make sure you don't burn bridges with owners and just you know, do it do it the right way. And I think to owners, obviously, we you know, owners are going to have to make some new tougher decisions, whether you have the money available to pay extra wages, you're going to have to find other ways to provide benefits to your employees, whether that's flexible time off so that they can be with their kids, or if they don't have childcare, other kind of benefits that might be associated with working at the job, or even finding creative ways for employees to even become owners within the restaurant. But I do think we're at a point now, where everyone's gonna have to be thinking a lot deeper and a lot harder than they ever have before.
Nan Wilkinson 28:14
I wholeheartedly agree with you. Well, I appreciate those words of wisdom. And again, thank you so much for being here. I'm sure we'll have more conversations later on. Algernon. I appreciate all you do for our industry.
Algenon Cash 28:25
Well, I appreciate you inviting me and I'm certainly willing to join you whenever you like to have me back.
Nan Wilkinson 28:30
That sounds great. Thank you so much. Take care. Thank you